Why Pay programmers?

[pjimmyinahouse]

I've always wondered why programmers charge for developing trading stategies. -sure if the strategy is either untested or underdeveloped then it makes sense. I'm sure progammers see 95% of the stategies as untradable or unprofitable-but I'm just guessing, otherwise they'd be offering their services for free.

But if you're asking someone to program a goldmine, wouldn't that be more than enough payment?

Personally I've never paid for programming, preferring to hack code to death myself But I'm new to NT so we'll see how much hair I lose trying to program...

[Elliott Wave]

Why pay anybody? You can always grow your own garden and raise cattle for food, code your own strategies and walk down to Wall-Street and submit orders yourself...

I'm kidding of course, but really, its to save time and effort. Time is money. While I haven't utilized the services of a NinjaScript consultant yet myself, I do plan to in the not to distant future.

Yes, I could buy some books and eventually hammer out some complex indicators and strategies myself, but honestly, I'd rather trade than program and likely many of the programmers would rather program than trade, and that's why they offer their services.

I understand your point though, especially in the age when some consider "free" to be the future of business.

Why does NinjaTrader offer its product for free? Simple, there are no factories making CDs and manuals, no retailers or distribution chains to pay yet there's the potential to access to almost every trader in the world with an internet connection. 1% of 1,000,000 people subscribing is better than 10% of 100,000 people, and its a lot easier to get there.

Yes if you have strategy like Maximillian Cohen in the movie "Pi" you may want to code that yourself. But ff such a strategy did exist, there'd be at least a few trading software developers on the Forbes list by now. In the meantime there will be plenty of people wishing to develop trading strategies and indicators beyond their technical capacity to do so, and developers happy to help for a reasonable cost...

[adrian]

Why pay programmers?

Because any skilled programmer has other things to do with their time than do your bidding.

Because if you pay them, then you can retain the rights to the code.

Because professional programmers will respect your intellectual property rights but programmers who work for free may not.

Because if you knew for a fact that your strategy would make money, then you would not need a programmer.

Because if you don't think it's worth your time or money to program your own strategy, it probably isn't worth anyone else's.

Because professional programmers aren't in the business of trading, they're in the business of programming. That's why you hire them!

[pjimmyinahouse]

I'm a designer by trade- so paying someone else to develop my ideas is a foreign concept to me.
-And one thing I do know for sure is that a good strategy is way harder to come by than programming it. Of course good ideas are few and far between for me

Adrian:


"Because any skilled programmer has other things to do with their time than do your bidding."
-You'd be surprised! Programmers are always looking for challenges and new strategies.

" Because if you knew for a fact that your strategy would make money, then you would not need a programmer."
-I think this would depend on your strategy and lifestyle.

[adrian]

PJ,

I'm a programmer (or was) and I'm not short of challenges. I don't need anyone else to help fill my plate But sure, I have collaborated with people before but only when I thought they had something I was interested in.

"I think this would depend on your strategy and lifestyle."

What I meant was that if you knew it worked then you could trade it manually for a while and make money and there wouldn't be a problem paying someone, or the time would be enough to do it yourself. Yes, some strategies would be difficult to trade manually, but then you couldn't be sure that it would be profitable


In general, I would be very suspicious of anyone that claimed to have a Sure Fire Money Maker but was too broke to pay me for my time.

[pjimmyinahouse]

Hi Adrian,

Yup I guess it comes down to whether a programmer feels an idea has merit or not. - which should be based on performance testing.(preferrably forward testing).

I've certainly heard a few and seen people going crazy over the latest EA's (metatrader..)
I'm all about using my perception rather than believing what I here so I'll test any that I feel have merit. While backtesting has mixed results, it can normally prove/disprove a stategy for me pretty quickly. (thats testing over >3 years)

Almost all those ideas are flawed somewhere. Normally its to do with current market conditions being favourable for a strategy.

-I agree with you about being suspicious.

[dtf139]

Just out of curiosity how does one find a programmer?

[adrian]

Just out of curiosity how does one find a programmer?

Ninja hosts a list of "certified" Ninjascript consultants. I've no idea what it takes to become certified, but hopefully it's something good. At any rate, you can check out a small list of these consultants at: http://www.ninjatrader.com/webnew/pa...injaScript.htm


You might also check something like rentacoder.com or other sites, maybe you'll find someone there.

[NinjaTrader_Dierk]

Just out of curiosity how does one find a programmer?

E.g here: http://www.ninjatrader.com/webnew/pa...injaScript.htm

[pjimmyinahouse]

haha, was just typing the same thing

Not sure but were you asking about a programmer who is free?
If so I guess this forum is a good place to start..
As discussed you'll probably have to convince someone that you idea has merit if they're doing it for free. How you do this I don't know but would be interested in other peoples ideas.

Generally for me (as a designer) the presentation of ideas is where 3/4 of the work is.
Regarding strategies: When I have an idea I'll tend to nut it out on screen for a while and then use something like MS project to create a flow diagram... but thats just me cuz I'm a visual person.

[dtf139]

Thanks. I didnt know about the consultants.
I've been wasting too much time dinking around trying to conform my ideas to the limitations of the strategy analyzer. Dont have the time to learn how to code.

[pjimmyinahouse]

At the risk of sounding insane for arguing with myself:
Trading should be treated like a business if you are to be successful.
Therefore investing in professional services is ... professional