Workspace Backup Problem

[Harry]

There is a serious NinjaTrader bug, which I have observed at least 20 times.

Whenever NinjaTrader crashes (genuine crash, information written to the trace file), such that you have to remove it via Windows Task Manager or Process Explorer, it will automatically save the crash configuration as the current workspace.

This is not what I expect. I do expect that if NinjaTrader crashes, that I can restart afterwards with my last saved configuration for the workspace. However, always after a crash my workspace is destroyed.

I am know creating a backup workspace, whenever I save my workspace, as the saving of the workspace is utterly useless, because NinjaTrader will destroy it sooner or later.

[NinjaTrader_Kyle]

Hi Harry,

Thank you for writing in.

Unfortunately, unexpected shut downs can result in corruption in .xml files where the end result is lost settings. This is a limitation of .xml files - not something we've put in to place purposely, saving over your existing settings.

While I understand your frustration with this, the only work-around at this time is to periodically backup so that, if this was to occur, you'd have settings which could be restored easily. That said, I will be sure to forward your comments here on to development for further consideration.

[Harry]

Kyle, thank you for your reply.

What I do not understand is this:

When I shut down NinjaTrader, it will always ask me, whether to save my workspace or not. I assume that up to that point, is has not been saved!

In case of a crash, however, it will automatically save the disaster workspace, thus destroying the correct one.

This has nothing to do with a limitation of xml.files. If NinjaTrader just ran a mirror image of the saved workspace and only saved the workspace, when asked to do so, you could easily recover the original workspace after a crash.

Very strange behavior. I have lost many workspaces because of this auto-deletion feature.

The second auto-deletion feature - just happened today again:

If you edit data, select an instrument and delete it, very often - although I am extremely careful to select it - it will not delete the selected, but the first row instead. Today I deleted several years of data for EURUSD on my second machine, and it was just the backup that saved me.

These two issues are really annoying, as NT permanently destroys data and workspaces.

[NinjaTrader_Dierk]

Harry,

Please let's keep issues separate:
a) on the "save workspaces when NT crashes" issue: yes, there (purposely) is a logic in place where NT would save all workspaces as a crash was experienced. Is that what you are complaining about?

b) on the "deleting data" issue: Would you have a reproducible scenario which helps us understanding the problem?

Thanks

[Harry]

Thanks for responding, Dierk.

(a) The problem with the logic the following:

-> First I do some work and build a nice workspace, called Alpha.
-> Now, I save this workspace. My work is now safe (this is what I think, because I have saved the file under the name Alpha).
-> Later I experience a crash. I have to shut down NT forcefully via Task Manager.
-> Then I restart. NT now opens the crashed workspace, which is now called Alpha.
-> My saved workspace Alpha is destroyed forever.

This may help you to track down the reason of the crash, as NinjaTrader preserves the crashed workspace, but it does not help me, because my all my prior work is destroyed, although I had saved it.

(b) When you edit the data via Historical Data Manager, and you want to delete an instrument, you automatically do it the same way, as you would do it when deleting a file in the Windows Explorer that is

(A1) right click the instrument, and select the "Delete" popup, which shows. However, this will destroy the first instrument in the drop down menu, so after some time typically all my currency data is gone. See screenshot 1.

What you need to do with NinjaTrader is

(A2) select the instrument per left click, then right click and select the "Delete" popup, which shows up. See screenshot 2.

The NinjaTrader procedure (A2) is counter-intuitive for two reasons.
-> first it does not work as Windows works
-> second, if you forget to select the instrument first, the Delete button will popup next to the right-clicked instrument, but if you press that button, the first instrument in the edit list will be destroyed and not the one next to the Delete button. Next day when you load your AUDUSD chart, all the data will be gone.....

What needs to be changed here is that right-clicking the instrument will also select it, such that it would behave as the Windows Explorer behaves.

[NinjaTrader_Dierk]

On (a): Got it. Next update will have an option to save the workspaces on crash (Default=no). That should resolve the issue.

On (b): I vaguely recall we already had been looking into that issue a while back but left it since not possible or too much risk involved. We'll again look into and let you know in case there could be done something.

Thanks

[Harry]

Thanks for the reply Dierk, I appreciate.

The issue (b) should be simple to resolve. This is a thing I know, but although I am fully aware of it, I am regularly deleting data that I do not want to delete. This a left side, right side of brain thing.

If you always right-click a file to select, copy or delete it (Windows training), you will do this with NinjaTrader as well. Then you realize that you are in London, and that the bus that ran you over came from the other side....

[NinjaTrader_Dierk]

On (b): We'll see. That's an Infragistics component which we only can control to the level of their API. I'll let you know...

[Harry]

On (b): We'll see. That's an Infragistics component which we only can control to the level of their API. I'll let you know...

I can cope with it, as I am regularly backing up my database. But a full restore takes about 15 minutes, so I am now doing it manually with the Windows Explorer, only using the Ninjatrader backup for the other files (excluding db). This makes it also easier to copy back the currency data selectively.

[NinjaTrader_Dierk]

On (b): Next NT7 update will hold the change you suggested. Thanks again for pointing that out.

[Harry]

Thanks for your help. Appreciated.

On (b): Next NT7 update will hold the change you suggested. Thanks again for pointing that out.