NinjaTrader Upgrades Remove Strategies

[Jack22]

I upgraded to 8.0.15 and after my upgrade ALL my strategies were removed from my workspace. I restored a backup from 1 week ago and then restarted NT8, but again, all the strategies were removed. I then took a workspace from my automated backups on my computer and tried using that, but the strategies still do not load.

What is going on? No errors in log or trace files when I try this.

[NinjaTrader_JoshG]

Hello Jack22,
Thanks for your post.

I have never looked to see if this happened between previous upgrades, but this most recent upgrade included a large update to workspace functionality. I am checking with Quality Assurance now to make sure this is expected behavior.

In the mean time, I suggest simply adding those strategies back manually.

[Jack22]

Hello Jack22,
Thanks for your post.

I have never looked to see if this happened between previous upgrades, but this most recent upgrade included a large update to workspace functionality. I am checking with Quality Assurance now to make sure this is expected behavior.

In the mean time, I suggest simply adding those strategies back manually.

If this was expected, I am begging NT to warn people of this in the future because I would have loved the opportunity to save all my strategies as templates--I fiddle with my settings occasionally and only save the updates in the workspace and not in a separate template, or hard coded changes in the strategies (I can have up to 10 loaded in a workspace at a time so rebuilding is a huge annoyance).

[Jack22]

Can you confirm if 15.1 will remove my strategies if I upgrade?

[cutzpr]

From my experience, sometimes when you upgrade, Ninja trader does not recognize your custom indicators or strategies. So the first time you open after an upgrade, your work space charts will not include your custom indicators or strategies. What I do is just open up a ninja script editor, recompile and close out ninja trader and reopen. Most importantly when it ask you if you want to save your work spaces select "NO". When you re-open, everything should be there.

[Jack22]

From my experience, sometimes when you upgrade, Ninja trader does not recognize your custom indicators or strategies. So the first time you open after an upgrade, your work space charts will not include your custom indicators or strategies. What I do is just open up a ninja script editor, recompile and close out ninja trader and reopen. Most importantly when it ask you if you want to save your work spaces select "NO". When you re-open, everything should be there.

Yup, I have exactly the same experience (except my strategies this past time did not reload correctly). When I upgraded to 15.0, I had to compile then restart (not save any workspace) to get my indicators to load (a fresh restart without compile didn't work last upgrade).

[NinjaTrader_JoshG]

Can you confirm if 15.1 will remove my strategies if I upgrade?

It did for me on my end. The answer I have gotten back so far is that there has always been removal logic that will do this during an upgrade. I am waiting to hear back from QA on why this is the case. I'll let you know when I have more info.

One other thing that I should bring up about R15 is that old copies of your workspaces are now automatically saved under Documents\NinjaTrader 8\workspaces\restore\ . So there is a good chance if you lost strategy instances you can get them back that way.

Help Guide - Restore workspace

[bertochi]

Updates are good, but when your strategies are working fine or with known problems, I simply postpone this updates but it complicates more than it helps matters.
As things stand, what unfortunately everyone should do is have a second computer and install whatever updates on that 2nd pc, go through all the pain, but knowing that your main setup has not been touched. Once you are satisfied, trade from your 2nd pc, and proceed with the update on your main pc. This is what "I" do. Another tip would be to never dare to change the location of the NT installation folder as you will also have potentially other problems with dll references from your old installation folder.
I wish Customer support made a smother transition from one version to another.

[brucerobinson]

Hello fellow future inhabitants of the insane asylum. In the hope my misfortune makes you guys feel better, thought I'd give you a laugh, whilst at the same time endorsing by anecdote some of the more serious points made here on upgrading protocols, backups, restores etc......

Created 216 Alert Conditions, to trigger sounds. One fine morning an eerie silence descended upon my household. They'd ALL 'mysteriously broken at the same time'.
I hadn't changed anything. I hadn't upgraded anything. Forum to the rescue - another User had just reported the same. No solution. Co-incidence of timing? Hmm.

Restore from (my fastidious) backups. From some backups they worked, others they didn't. Then some that worked broke. Then some worked again, then didn't. Some that hadn't worked, then did. (I'm sure you're getting the gist by now...)

Onus clearly on me to spend (even more of my) time to 'create for us a reproducible scenario, without which we can't help'. Err, what part of 'they were all working, then all broke and I didn't do anything. And when I restore from various backups they seemingly have a mind of their own. (Which is more than can now be said for me, BTW) didn't I make clear?

The one thing that is consistently reproducible is that they don't work properly, in ooh so many different ways it ain't even funny.

Re-created some Alerts from scratch (not from restored backups). They worked. Re-created all 216 Alert Conditions (heads-up in case you consider it, they can't be saved to a template, When It's Gone, It's Gone. Who's half-baked idea was that? I trust they are now permanently nailed to the Naughty Step with neither food, water nor toileting facilities). They all worked. Then bang all broken again. You know the drill by now....

(Eventually) after much pressing to go speak to Development about what could be causing this looking with a 'top-down perspective' at what I was experiencing rather than asking me for reproducible scenarios and asking could they think of/did they do anything that could have caused this sort of outcome, Development admitted they'd pushed out a change that 'they think may have broken Alerts'. Oh, really, you don't say.....

I think I'll give 15.1 a few more days before starting over. After all, 15.0 didn't last 24hrs.

But, on the serious note of the points you raise, what happens when 15.2 comes out? Or another change is pushed out under the radar? (no Alerts template remember, every one from scratch, and WIGIG).

The 'good news' is I see about eleventeen-hundred Alert Fixes in the Release Notes, so hopefully now resolved.

Disconnected a few Strategy Templates? Pah! I dream of only having a few (10 - pah!) strategy templates to re-build or re-select, at least you've got a template. 'A huge annoyance' - pah! you don't know the meaning of the word! Pah! Don't know you're born

I agree with the points you guys have made

You're not supposed take pleasure in the misfortune of others, but in this case my gift is belly-laughs all round. Have one on me.
:-(

[bertochi]

Thank you for sharing.

I share your pain. I've put as many hours as you did probably.

We chose NT, or at least me, thinking it was a robust software, and I am not saying it isn't. But all this bugs with updates, loosing your strategies, etc, let you down.

I suggest you schedule back ups of your whole NT user directory.
Every new NT update might add new folders, or change the structure of the existing one.
Learn about some sync software, which will show you the changes and comparison between your newly updated user folder and your "working" last one.

Every update should do what all programs do, update the program and leave your user data untouched. But no, this is not the way with NT.

[brucerobinson]

Indeed.
I use Synctools.
Plus clone my SSD every week.
Plus run Ninja Backup every day.

A self-preservation strategy. Arrogance, incompetence, denial and a complete lack of culpability and contrition is a toxic combination.

[NinjaTrader_PatrickH]

Hello cutzpr,

Thank you for your post.

From my experience, sometimes when you upgrade, Ninja trader does not recognize your custom indicators or strategies. So the first time you open after an upgrade, your work space charts will not include your custom indicators or strategies. What I do is just open up a ninja script editor, recompile and close out ninja trader and reopen. Most importantly when it ask you if you want to save your work spaces select "NO". When you re-open, everything should be there.

This is not expected behavior. Are these your own custom NinjaScript objects or a third party's?

I look forward to your response.

[cutzpr]

Hello cutzpr,

Thank you for your post.


This is not expected behavior. Are these your own custom NinjaScript objects or a third party's?

I look forward to your response.

These are my own custom indicators and strategies.

[NinjaTrader_PatrickH]

Hello cutzpr,

Thank you for your response.

Would it be possible to test these files on our end and a workspace that you used that reproduces this behavior?

If so, please send me a note at platformsupport[at]ninjatrader[dot]com with 'ATTN: Patrick H' in the subject line and a reference to this thread in the body of the email.

I look forward to your response.

[NinjaTrader_PatrickH]

Hello Jack22,

Thank you for your patience.

May we schedule a remote support session to look into this behavior on your PC?

If so, please send me a note at platformsupport[at]ninjatrader[dot]com with 'ATTN: Patrick H' in the subject line and a reference to this thread.

I look forward to your response.