MultiCore and Trading

[neb1998]

Are there plans to incorporate MultiCore Support within charting in the near future?

In terms of just more processed being optimized for multicore support. Like with MC that will run one chart per core when advanced calculations are taking place in real time...Tick Data etc.

Thanks

BK

[NinjaTrader_Chip]

Hello neb1998

Thank you for your post.

NinjaTrader 7 comes with optimized multi core/multi-processor support. This e.g. would allow you to make full usage of multi-core/ multi-processor hardware. However, due to the nature of the Window OS, NinjaTrader 7 would not be able to fully use all available multi-cores/multi-processors at any given time.

Perhaps some other on the forum can weigh in with their input & experience on this topic

[neb1998]

Ok

Hello neb1998

Thank you for your post.

NinjaTrader 7 comes with optimized multi core/multi-processor support. This e.g. would allow you to make full usage of multi-core/ multi-processor hardware. However, due to the nature of the Window OS, NinjaTrader 7 would not be able to fully use all available multi-cores/multi-processors at any given time.

Perhaps some other on the forum can weigh in with their input & experience on this topic

I was looking for a real response as to is it in the plans to have more features within ninjatrader supporting more cores. The amount of cores that windows manages has nothing to do with how many cores ninja is able to use at one time. Most operations in ninja other than optimizations run on a single core. If 2 cores are available in windows as the system is using 3% of the load the other 97% can be used by a program that is multithreaded. Programs that utilize 100% of one core are not fully multithreaded.

[maggiej12]

I'd be interested in learning more about this. Does anyone have any updates or info on this?

I am planning to get a new computer soon & want to know what would be best for me as far as RAM & processors, etc.
Right now when i have more than 3 charts in any given workspace, it takes forever for me to load my charts & it is too slow for me to trade well. My screen starts to freeze up, especially when there is alot of volatility.
I've talked to Ninja support before and they said normally i should not be having this problem & i didn't before until i started using a new 3rd party indicator that takes up a lot more space than the old indicator i used to use.

Can anyone give me feedback on some of the things i'm deciding on given my scenario above....

dual core vs. quad core processor (both at 3.0ghz)??
3mb Cache memory vs. 6mb??
4gb RAM vs. 6gb vs. 8gb??
768p display vs. 900p??
500gb hard drive vs. 750 or 1000gb??

thanks!

[NinjaTrader_AdamP]

maggie,

NinjaTrader uses only one core in real time, however can use multiple threads for backtesting/optimization. Future versions may have additional cores for real time in use.

If you plan on doing a lot of optimization or multitasking with NinjaTrader open I would suggest that the more cores you have the merrier. Four should be more than sufficient. However, since real time uses 1 core the faster the processor the better your performance will be. Generally, the larger the processor cache also the better performance you have (with some exceptions).

As far as memory, 2GB is the minimum required but most modern PC's come with 4GB. This should be sufficient. If you plan on loading lots of applications at once, or loading many charts and having many indicators on the charts you may want to increase the RAM amount.

Display is a personal issue. I would recommend getting a display/video setup that looks good to your eyes and fits within your budget.

The hard drive size is not as important as the others. This is just how much storage space you have on your PC for files. Applications will load faster with faster hard drives, however.

Please let me know if I may assist further.

[koganam]

You have specified all the important factors. Just use the maximum values for each. Applications just have a way of meeting whatever computer you have, so the more oomph you start with, the longer the computer will last without becoming seemingly too slow.

You might want to get a video card with as much memory and speed as you can afford. But you do not need to go overboard and get a card designed for gaming. In today's world, a 1GB video card is quite sufficient, and should cost well below $100.

If you really want to isolate NT, you can do what I did.

1. I built a 16GB, 6-core computer.
2. Carved out 3MB memory and 50GB hard drive space for a virtual machine,
3. Installed Windows XP SP3 and NT into the virtual machine, and the only application that runs in the virtual machine is NT.

That way, I am guaranteed a quantum of resources, and no possible memory interference from any other application, as the VM runs sandboxed in isolated memory space. It also means that as I do absolutely NOTHING in the VM but NT, I need not bother with resource eating anti-malware of any kind in the virtual machine.

I do development on the main machine. That way, my development is isolated from my trading machine, and I get to use all the multiple cores when I am testing and optimizing. It also means that any mistakes I make in my development do not affect the trading setup.

Just my $0.02.

[maggiej12]

thank you both for your feedback.

koganam: that sounds very interesting. since i'm due for an upgrade to my computer anyway, i will probably just go with a new one that has all the capabilities i need rather than building a machine. I understand a decent amount about computers but it sounds like that might be more work than i want to get into now.

i was actually wondering if a gaming computer would be good for day trading.
one of the computers i'm looking at says it comes with 64 - 1696MB (shared) video memory.
would that translate to the 1GB video card you suggested?
how hard is it to replace a video card or what if the computer doesn't come with video memory, is it possible to add a video card?

thanks again.

[AutoTrade12]

Koganam's setup is by far the best you can do all factors considered. I have had more trouble than I care to remember dealing with trading systems that are being used as a regular PC by traders that think their high end system is going to allow them to safely run NT and every other application they use on a day to day basis.

PC's that are built for gaming will do very well as a trading system, could be overkill if you are not using it for development. The display setup you use will have a huge impact on your ability to "see" the market and execute a fast response. Multiple monitor setups are a blessing. I use three LCD's with the main one being a 42" LCD HDTV. If you plan on spending a great deal of time looking at charts or watching multiple markets, don't hold back on your monitor setup. Super expensive video cards would not be money well spent. NT does not require leading edge 3D rendering and texture mapping support.

A solid state drive for OS and application storage is a big boost in speed. If optimization is killing all of your time, then you are not optimizing your usage of the optimizer itself. Over optimization is even worse than not optimizing at all, believe it or not. Curve fitting only does well in backtests, forward tests will show horrible returns.

All "live" trading done with full automation, should be done on simple inexpensive PC that is not used for anything else.

That is the best advice I can give. Good luck.

[koganam]

thank you both for your feedback.

koganam: that sounds very interesting. since i'm due for an upgrade to my computer anyway, i will probably just go with a new one that has all the capabilities i need rather than building a machine. I understand a decent amount about computers but it sounds like that might be more work than i want to get into now.

i was actually wondering if a gaming computer would be good for day trading.
one of the computers i'm looking at says it comes with 64 - 1696MB (shared) video memory.
would that translate to the 1GB video card you suggested?
how hard is it to replace a video card or what if the computer doesn't come with video memory, is it possible to add a video card?

thanks again.

Shared memory for video is a bad idea that just will not go away. With the prices of memory today, no manufacturer should even attempt to justify this shared memory nonsense. You really do want a card with dedicated memory. You can always add in a good quality video card, and disable the on-board video if necessary.

[sledge]

I like that idea.


You're main OS would be Windows x64 Ultimate?

Or did you use another type of virtual software?

You have specified all the important factors. Just use the maximum values for each. Applications just have a way of meeting whatever computer you have, so the more oomph you start with, the longer the computer will last without becoming seemingly too slow.

You might want to get a video card with as much memory and speed as you can afford. But you do not need to go overboard and get a card designed for gaming. In today's world, a 1GB video card is quite sufficient, and should cost well below $100.

If you really want to isolate NT, you can do what I did.

1. I built a 16GB, 6-core computer.
2. Carved out 3MB memory and 50GB hard drive space for a virtual machine,
3. Installed Windows XP SP3 and NT into the virtual machine, and the only application that runs in the virtual machine is NT.

That way, I am guaranteed a quantum of resources, and no possible memory interference from any other application, as the VM runs sandboxed in isolated memory space. It also means that as I do absolutely NOTHING in the VM but NT, I need not bother with resource eating anti-malware of any kind in the virtual machine.

I do development on the main machine. That way, my development is isolated from my trading machine, and I get to use all the multiple cores when I am testing and optimizing. It also means that any mistakes I make in my development do not affect the trading setup.

Just my $0.02.

[koganam]

Actually the VM is VirtualBox. I find it a bit easier to configure, as I prefer dedicated application interfaces to web interfaces.

I am thinking of moving my main OS to Windows Server 2008, in which case, I may reconsider my choice of VM, and maybe just use the Hyper-V hypervisor available in the OS.

[FREEN]

I´m running NT on a easily rescaleable cloud server, OS Windows Server 2008 R2. When loading a heavy indicator (infinite lookback, but no file reading/writing except form NT db) I got these results:

1 core, 2 GB memory - 60 sec
8 cores, 16 GB memory - 45 sec

Not much use of heavy gear in my simple test. A high frequency core is obviously of more use than a multi core processor. Is reading of the NT db a heavy task for NT?

[NinjaTrader_AdamP]

FREEN,

Reading the DB shouldn't be computationally complex.

Future versions of NinjaTrader will use more multi-core features.